Press Conference - Barrow-In-Furness, England

ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA: Can I thank Secretary Wallace, who's joined me for this tour of these excellent facilities right here in Barrow. And indeed, it's been an enormous privilege. And I want to thank BAE as well for showing us around these facilities and to thank the workers who've given us a warm welcome and spoken firsthand about the work that they are doing, which, of course, will have implications now due to the AUKUS arrangements for what Australia will be doing. While we've been here as well, we've actually met Australians who are here already. But over the years, I can expect that number to vastly, vastly rise as Australians come here to learn the skills that they will need for the production of SSN-AUKUS, and also, of course, to be able to then take those skills to Adelaide, to Osborne shipyards, where I toured with Premier Malinauskus just a few weeks ago. It's no surprise that the Premier himself was here looking at these facilities, and that my Defence Minister and Deputy Prime Minister, Richard Marles, was also here earlier this year. I expect that there will be ongoing delegations of Australians here to Barrow to look at these facilities and to learn the implications for the development that Australia will have. The AUKUS arrangements are about our national security, and about our common interests between Australia, the United Kingdom and the United States to uphold the international rule of law, to cooperate in both the development of nuclear-powered submarines for Australia, but also with other technological cooperation with the engagement as a part of AUKUS phase two going forward But it's about something more than our national security as well. It's about jobs. It's about jobs and economic prosperity. Here in Barrow, it is a great example of people who live very close to these facilities, who are in secure, well-paid jobs for their lifetime. It's about the extraordinary number of apprentices who are being employed here, to learn those skills. And I want those opportunities to be held in Australia. We regard the development of an advanced, highly sophisticated manufacturing capability in Australia as having implications not just for our defence, but for other industries as well. And I see this as being very similar to what the car industry provided for Australia in the post-war period. An industry that created jobs and security for communities during decades, but also had indirect spin offs in other industries as well. And that will happen right here. I am very much looking forward to Australia having our own state-of-the-art submarine shipyard there at Osborne. And I know that the South Australian Premier is as well. What that will require, as well, is a massive upskilling of our workforce. And that's why we've already got an MoU with South Australia about providing those facilities, about making sure that people get not just through TAFE and the blue-collar work that will be required, but also through universities, and through the sort of work that will be required as we move forward in the coming years. Can I say that, importantly, as well, I think there'll be some exchange from the UK to Australia as part of this, that we want to go forward with our common interest. And this visit today has certainly been a step forward in that. And I thank Secretary Wallace for hosting us here.

BEN WALLACE, UK SECRETARY OF STATE FOR DEFENCE: Thank you, Prime Minister. And welcome to Barrow. And I thank your High Commissioner for the visit here today for this special part of the Northwest, not far from where I live, not far from where I represent. This is a very special place for all of us, a corner of Cumbria that is a world leader in the manufacturing of some of the most advanced engineering on the planet. We not only make here our attack submarines, we also make our nuclear bombers. And as you've seen today, Prime Minister, on the tour, it's extremely complex engineering, bringing together thousands of people to create engineering and share technology. We have here American technology alongside United Kingdom technology in all the domains. 70 years ago, plus one month, our first nuclear submarine, HMS Dreadnought, left this place and went into service with the Royal Navy. A 70 year endeavour. It's an exclusive club, nuclear-powered submarines, that give us strategic capability that only five nations on earth currently haven't. And I am delighted Australia joining that club. The President of the United States absolutely stands shoulder-to-shoulder in making sure that is delivered with Australia and for Australia, and that it cements, even strongly, powers with the same values, belief in human rights, liberal open democracies, where those values are being settled around the world. And hard power always complements soft power. And that's important. This is serious business. And I'm delighted the Prime Minister is here. There are huge opportunity for Australians and Australian jobs. There will be Australian hands making submarines in Barrow. And those hands will go back to Australia and make submarines in Australia. 11,000 workers here, growing towards 17,000. That's the big endeavour. That endeavour will be replicated in jobs and opportunities for Australians. And it will be exciting. And I hope to see more and more interchanges between people from here and Cumbria, to Australia, and vice versa. That's what we see in the aerospace industry not far down the road, where we see the manufacturers of Typhoon in Germany and Spain and Italy, moving across those three countries to produce the partnership. So, it's exciting. Nothing gets delivered overnight. As I said, 70 years since our first Dreadnought sailed out of here. It's going to be working together. But I'm confident that, first and foremost, the Royal Navy, the Royal Australian Navy, will be working hand in hand to make sure we design a submarine for both of us. This is not a one-way procurement. This is a joint effort, a joint procurement. That will mean we're ready in the 2030s to see the threats that are approaching us far. Thank you.

PRIME MINISTER: Before I take questions, just comments on two things. One is on the passing of Allan Gyngell. Allan Gyngell is one of Australia's greatest diplomats, foreign affairs experts, of course, a former head of the ONA, the forerunner of the Office of National Intelligence. And his passing should be noted by the Australian Prime Minister. And I do so today. And I pass on my respects to all of his many family and friends.

And secondly, can I take the opportunity just to thank the Secretary of State, Secretary Wallace, for his assistance in Australians being evacuated from Sudan. This was a very dangerous circumstance. It remains dangerous, of course. And the United Kingdom, once again, our friends, responded to every request. And Australians were able, in recent times as well, just very recently, to assist with the evacuation of some UK citizens as well. A good example about cooperation.

Happy to take questions.

JOURNALIST: What have you learned personally by being here today? And on the Budget that we've seen in the last week or so, the Parliamentary Budget Office are talking about contingency for $120 billion potentially added to the bill that has already been publicly attached to the AUKUS project. What can you say to the Australian people about the risk of any cost?

PRIME MINISTER: I'll say two things. Well, there are two questions. So, I'll answer both of them. Firstly, with regard to what I've learned, I think that in the briefings that I had, through the NSC committee, that must have met at times, three times a week, over many, many months, indeed, I've been in office for almost a year. And of course, I received briefings also as Leader of the Labor Party before then. You can go through all the briefings. But until you actually go and have a look firsthand, I think it is easy to underestimate the scale of what's happened here. The other thing that's clear about coming here is the impact that this has on this local community. So many of the people who I've met today, and we would have met, and I would have spoken personally to over 100 people, but we obviously met many more than that. There's an extraordinary number are local. They're from here. They're either directly from Barrow or small towns near here, but certainly from Cumbria. And the driving force that it has in the local economy as well is very significant. The fact that you have housing built here and people will walk to work was something that Richard Marles, before I came, spoke about how important that was. The other thing we've met is young apprentices, but also some people being retrained. And one of the things that we need to do as our economy changes, is not just provide opportunities for young people, but provide people with opportunities in new careers as well. And these jobs are jobs for life that we're talking about here. We're talking about secure, well-paid jobs. The company here has very good relations with unions. So, we've spoken about that. And I've spoken about making sure that we get representative bodies coming here as well. And that was encouraged by the company and by Secretary Wallace. That will be organised in coming months.

On costs, we were very transparent in the cost. We didn't try and gild the lily about what the cost would be when we made the announcements, which were $268 billion to $368 billion. Those are costs, with due respect to the Parliamentary Budget Office, our costs are done by the Department of Defence and Finance and Treasury. We're very transparent out there. We believe that this is a substantial investment. It's an investment in jobs, investment in our economy and an investment in our capability. And it is certainly one that is worthwhile. It is good that it enjoys bipartisan support in our national Parliament. And that's important for a project that will last for a long period of time.

JOURNALIST: Our submarines will depend very much on your knowledge and your technology. What guarantees can you give to the Prime Minister beside you that this won't be delayed or over budget? And what will this also do for Australia's defence posture? We are often talked about as being a middle-power. How would you view Australia once we have these AUKUS submarines?

UK SECRETARY OF STATE FOR DEFENCE: Well, first of all, the best guarantee is, if there is delay and it is over budget, my submarines will be delayed and over budget. And I don't want that either. And the submarines that we put out right now, they have a shelf life. And you have to replace them. So, there is no, 'Let's take a big gap'. We have to deliver them. We have to deliver them together. The shared technology requires us to also make sure we're building together. The reactive things like that will be predominantly a shared technology, or certainly, we'll be helping each other as far as we can. So, I think, first and foremost, it's in my interest, as well as Australia's interest, that we get these on time and on budget. A brief word about the budget. Look, it's always hard to get your head round, including ministers of treasuries, which I have to deal with. This is a 20-30 year project, right? Putting an accurate or really accurate price on it would just be deceiving people, right? I mean, the reason the Prime Minister said there's a bracket is because you've got to set up a regulator, your regulator will put requirements on its nuclear industry. You can't sit here and make a political decision and know exactly how everything's going to last over the next 30 years. And that's the same here. How much dredging do I have to do out there? How many piers do I have to build? All of those things plus inflation. So, we have to level with the public. And I think Australia has been really level the public. This is a big jump, a big strategic decision, which answers your second question. It becomes a strategic power, right? It's joined an exclusive club, that, in theory, it could send the submarines under the water around the world. It doesn't just have to be in the Pacific. You know, we sent HMS Astute with our carrier group last year. Because it COVID, she was lucky, because they've been under the water, they got to get out in Australia, they actually got to come alongside in Australia.

PRIME MINISTER: Welcome tourists.

UK SECRETARY OF STATE FOR DEFENCE: They weren't allowed off. I think your Governor was a bit strict, and they weren't actually allowed off the pier, the Premier. But I think, fundamentally, it's a strategic capability. And it keeps adversaries guessing, 'Where's your submarine? How many submarines have you got?' And we're going to design these submarines to deliver payloads, a step change from what they currently deliver. They are going to be able to do a huge range of stuff, some of it very secret, some of that very traditional strike capabilities, torpedoes, etc. But a whole range of new capabilities. And it's really important now in the design phase, and the design doesn't get locked down for a few more years, there's a sense of timing, right? The design will go on. But the bulk of the design, there's another three or four years of that. And that's the time that we get in early, we make sure we shape it for both our needs and then we move forward. But I am confident we are going to deliver. The investment we're doing right now is to make sure that there are no backup and queues, right? We're investing in the dull stuff. I mean, this is the important thing is governments hollow out defence budgets. And the hollowing out usually translates into the boring things. Dry docks, cranes. But they're the ones that cost you money in the long run, because you need to service your ships and submarines, they're not there, and everything gets delayed, and it costs more. So, we're investing now in the infrastructure, now in the skills in this building nearly a thousand apprenticeships start. That's exciting. I hope to travel to Australia and see young men and women starting their future in those skills as well. That's really important. And we'll do everything to support that in the curriculum and everything else. But I'm confident we are going to see some really great job opportunities growing in Australia. My only fear is that you come over here to sign up all our people.

JOURNALIST: Are you able to share some of the thought process into acquiring the SSN-AUKUS over, I guess, the established Virginia class, and that you can see that new class comes with some sort of risk?

PRIME MINISTER: We think, absolutely, it's the right decision. And we also were determined, when we came into government, to make sure that we were manufacturing our own submarines. What the SSN-AUKUS does, is, if you like, if you're talking about risks, the fact that we're both doing the same product, the first product will begin rolling off here in the 2030s and the 2040s in Australia. But we will start on construction, some of the transformation, at Osborne in Adelaide next year. We start immediately, in effect. There's already the planning taking place. We're already planning for the skills base to work that up. As the Secretary said, you'll have a timeframe of the design being done, completed by the end of this decade, but most of it being done in the next three or four years. And construction activity we expect to start, will commence here first, but will start by the end of this decade as well at Osborne and step up. In the meantime, of course, we will purchase three, but with the possibility of a couple more, Virginia class submarines from the United States so that we ensure that there's not a capability gap between the Collins and the SSN-AUKUS being manufactured. But we wanted to make sure that this wasn't just about defence, but was about manufacturing and about jobs. One of the themes of my campaign, as you will recall, is I wanted a future made in Australia. We see this as being absolutely central. And the things I've learned today, some of which we can talk about, I think, is, certainly the headline we can talk about, is just the scale of the manufacturing we're talking about. We're talking about the most sophisticated manufacturing task on the planet, which is why it has to be got right, which is why Australians coming here and seeing that will be worthwhile, which is why, as well, the visits of submarines, firstly from the United States this year, in '23, UK submarines visiting from 2026. And then you'll have visits on rotation from 2027. And what that will do is enable Australians, of course, to be on board those submarines, learning the skills firsthand. You can learn things in a book or in a classroom. But it doesn't quite count as much as learning things by doing. And that's why this thought-out plan that we've laid out very transparently before the Australian people, I'm very confident is the right one.

JOURNALIST: This is the first time we've had a chance to speak to you. You met with the King yesterday. What can you tell us about that audience with His Majesty? And as a republican leader of a democracy that believes in free speech, what do you make of republicans in the UK planning to protest the Coronation?

PRIME MINISTER: Well, lastly, that people have a right to express their views in a democracy. So, there will be people in Australia that have the same view. I support an Australian, as Australia's head of state. That doesn't mean that I don't respect the institutions. And it certainly doesn't mean that I don't respect King Charles, both as a person but also as Australia's head of state. That is our constitutional arrangements which we have. And as the Australian Prime Minister, I will respect the arrangements that we have across the board. I can't speak about any detail. Because that's part of the protocol of an audience with King Charles. I can say, though, that it was very warm. I appreciated the discussion that we had. And that King Charles has a great love and an affection for Australia. It comes from his time as a student there, but also his many visits to Australia. He is very familiar with the range of issues that Australia is facing. And I can confirm that I once again reiterated that King Charles and Queen Camilla would be very welcome visitors to Australia, as would any other member of the Royal Family. And that on behalf of Australia, as the Australian Prime Minister, Australians wish him well. And I certainly am looking forward to being at the Coronation on Saturday. And I'm sure it will be successful. One of the things about the United Kingdom, Mr Secretary, is they know how to put on an event. And I have no doubt that this will be a very historic event. It's the first time it's happened in my lifetime. I regard it as a great honour to be the Australian Prime Minister. And I regard it as part of that is my attendance and representing Australia at such an important event, along with, of course, the Governor General of Australia. And I'm very pleased that the delegation who will be visiting, who will be there on Saturday, will be led by our flagbearer, Sam Kerr, who, of course, is a great West Australian, a great sports woman, and who I hope that it gives her that little bit of further oomph for her prospects of leading Australia to World Cup glory in Australia and New Zealand in a short period of time.

JOURNALIST: What does it mean to you to swear allegiance to the King during the Coronation?

PRIME MINISTER: I do it every time that I'm sworn into Parliament, as other Members of Parliament do. He is our head of state. And that is something that every Member of Parliament does.

JOURNALIST: The AUKUS arrangement, obviously, you have China going around the region, talking about the sort of playing it up as a very negative thing. And that does have some traction in parts of the regions. Australia still have a job to do around the UK as well, in persuading the region that this is a beneficial arrangement to the region's stability and security.

PRIME MINISTER: Well, what we want in the Indo-Pacific is a secure, peaceful, stable and prosperous region. That's the objective that we have. And in my view, a secure Australia is in the interests of a secure region. So, we have engaged, prior to the AUKUS arrangements, and my visit to San Diego, along with Prime Minister Sunak, who I'm looking forward to meeting again on Friday, and President Biden who, of course, I'll meet in Australia, shortly, but I'll meet both of them as well at the G7 in Japan. We contacted and briefed a range of leaders in the region. I think it is understood, Australia's interests. And I believe it's been received in a positive manner. We will continue to engage in the region. One of the things that my Government is doing is reaching out and reconnecting with the world. We are investing in our capability, but we're also investing in our relationships. And that's why, whether it is ASEAN, whether it be the Quad, whether it be the Pacific Island Forum, or whether it be our friends in the United Kingdom and in Europe, we're engaging across a range of issues. I say, in the region as well, the entry fee for credibility in the Pacific region is taking climate change seriously. My Government does just that. And we have substantially improved relationships in the Pacific, which I think is obvious for all to see, by the fact of the official visits that we've received from as late as the last one was, last Thursday, I met with the President of Nauru. But I've welcomed the Prime Minister of Samoa, the Prime Minister of Vanuatu, the Prime Minister of the Solomon Islands, the Prime Minister of Papua New Guinea, and other regional leaders. And Penny Wong, as our Foreign Minister, has visited every single nation in the Pacific Island Forum.

JOURNALIST: You've expressed a view about Julian Assange previously. And your counterpart here has also expressed very strong views about it. I'm just wondering whether that's come up in discussion with Mr Wallace or whether you are planning to talk about it?

PRIME MINISTER: One of the things I do is behave diplomatically. So, I won't give you a briefing in advance of meetings, as you wouldn't expect me to do. But my position has not changed from the time I was Labor Leader and as the Prime Minister of Australia, that I believe enough is enough. And it is time that this issue be brought to a conclusion. I've said that. One of the things about me you'll find, except for when it's a national security issue, is my comments in public are the same as my comments in private.

JOURNALIST: (Inaudible).

UK SECRETARY OF STATE FOR DEFENCE: I think, first of all, as you say, they are initial reports. I've seen the Kremlin statement. I haven't seen a statement from Ukraine. We will obviously assess what we've seen in the open media. And then we'll probably issue a comment later. But at the moment, I'm not going to make a comment, because it's pretty much been a one-sided comment by the Russians. And I think what we've learned in this whole conflict is I wouldn't take at face-value comments by Russia. But I've seen the footage. We'll make an assessment and then they I can comment further at a later date.

PRIME MINISTER: Thank you very much.

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